Unleashing Excellence Through Mentorship: Mark Jordan's Journey and Goal of Empowering One Million Men

Ever wondered how a mentorship can transform your life and unleash a journey of excellence? On our latest episode of the Balance Business Dad Podcast, we sit down with Mark Jordan, a dedicated mentor who guides men towards a path of success, not just in their businesses but in all aspects of life, from faith to finances.

Our chat with Mark takes you behind the scenes of his organization Unravel Groups, revealing its ambitious goal of reaching one million men in the next decade. We delve into Mark's philosophy of 'disintegration' as a crucial step for growth and the significance of forging meaningful relationships with other men. Mark's insights will make you rethink your approach towards progress and perfection, equipping you with the tools to empower your personal and professional journey.

As a bonus, Mark takes us on a tour of his own transformative journey, sharing his experiences in investment banking, starting a church in Atlanta, North Point Ministries and being mentored by spiritual leaders like Andy Stanley. His inspiring story will leave you motivated to overcome your challenges and accelerate towards your goals. Don't miss out on Mark's powerful advice and join us on the Balance Business Dad Podcast.

You can find out more about Mark and Unravel at unravelgroups.com

Join ~300 other Dads like you by joining The Balanced Business Dad's Facebook group here: dadupgroup.com

Check out our website at: thebalancedbusinessdad.com

Transcript

Narrator: 0:01

Dads, do you want a thriving business that doesn't control you, a passionate marriage and kids that adore you? Do you want to grow deeper in your faith, be healthier both physically and mentally, build more meaningful relationships with your friends? Welcome to the Balance Business Dad podcast, where, in each episode, we dive into balancing and optimizing the six pillars of life Faith, health, marriage, fatherhood, brotherhood and business. And here are your hosts, pioneers of the Balance Business Dad movement Dustin Hoag and RJ Campbell.

Coach Dustin: 0:37

Hey, what's going on everybody? Welcome to another episode of the Balance Business. Dad, I'm your host, coach Dustin with me, as always, the very seasoned, the very distinguished Mr RJ Campbell. Rj, how are you doing today?

R. J. Campbell: 0:50

Seasoned, seasoned. Yes, yes, you are. That's it. That's all I got Awesome.

Coach Dustin: 0:57

So, guys, two episodes in a row, we have something special for you, because a lot of times our episodes are just RJ and I kind of giving whatever's going on, but the last episode and this episode we are interviewing someone else, so you can just not listen to us talk and actually get some real experts in the world. So, guys, I want everybody to welcome to the show. Mr Mark Jordan, mark welcome.

Mark Jordan: 1:22

Thank you so much. I was just really waiting with anticipation to see what adjective you were going to use to describe. This season was an interesting one, so I was okay. What's it going to be for me?

Coach Dustin: 1:33

I'm glad I didn't get one, so I'm doing good. Yeah, so probably like the first 30 episodes we did, I tried to come up with different adjectives each time for RJ and finally just season and distinguish stuck.

Mark Jordan: 1:43

So yeah, I love it. I love it, that's great.

R. J. Campbell: 1:47

We're way past the creativity of trying to figure out other ways to say old yeah, that's great. Well, I love it.

Mark Jordan: 1:55

I'm excited to be on with you guys.

Coach Dustin: 1:56

So are we? So, Mark, we're just going to jump right into it. So obviously our goal with the Balanced Business Dad is just to help business fathers, business husbands, business people in general on the important areas of life, and we know that through our six pillars being faith, health, marriage, fatherhood, brotherhood and then business and you know you have a lot going on. So when we saw this, we definitely wanted to get you on the show and just kind of learn about who you are and the organization you run and what you're out there doing.

Mark Jordan: 2:26

Yeah, great, and it's interesting. I love the one. I first saw your six pillars because you know we have a lot of our content organized around five categories faith, family, friends, fitness, finances which are just different ways of saying your six pillars. We just haven't have them in five, and certainly the faith element is obviously the wrapping around everything, so everything exists within that faith element. It's just a question of kind of where you are on that journey. So I love seeing the commonality of that. I also love seeing some of your guys themes and some of your narratives that you discuss, because our big one is growth.

Mark Jordan: 3:05

We really just want men to be on a growth journey and I know it'll be you guys. But my personal experience has been over the years I'm 61 now, so I've had a lot of years to experience things and I find the vast majority of men really aren't on a journey a growth of excellence. So our mission is actually to lead men into a growing relationship with Christ by equipping them for leadership. And here's the key the pursuit of excellence. We really feel like men have not been I don't know if the word is educated, challenged, whatever you want to call it. They're just not on the pursuit of excellence, and that's what we're really trying to equipment to do is to get on that journey, which, of course, will then cause them to be a light and to draw other people to them.

Coach Dustin: 3:52

And I love that and you know it's interesting because we talk about this a lot. I have been self-employed for a long time and in the realm I've been in personal development was heavy in real estate and as a real estate agent personal development was so inundated in sight of the real estate industry so I didn't realize and I don't know why I didn't realize it that not everybody was on the same personal growth that I was, and RJ, who's had 35 years of corporate America experience, wasn't as familiar with it as I am. So I couldn't agree with you more that it's just growth in general and I love excellence, I love that word excellence and the pursuit of excellence just isn't there. So how and why did you get started in this world that you're in? I love the story.

Mark Jordan: 4:44

Yeah, you know, when I first got out of graduate school I encountered my first experience with men mentoring me and investing in my life. I'd never really encountered that before and it was different. It was interesting. It was cut 20 years off of my learning curve and then coupled that with kind of a lifetime of journey of groups, all different kinds of groups you know, small groups and larger groups and groups with my wife and groups without my wife and just in then surveying, talking to my friends over the years, like what really gets you excited about a group, what gets you motivated to show up and really look forward to it every week and not burn out on it.

Mark Jordan: 5:26

But what we found what I found, at least with my, the people that I am connected with on this topic is that men need something that's challenging, something that really calls them to more. It can't just be a hangout session, but it's a hangout session that gets old. It's fine for a bit, but it gets old. And then the flip side is there needs to be some intellectual aspect to it, but it can't be over the top, right. If it feels like it's a classroom every time, then that's gonna be a bit of a hindrance for men to grow.

Mark Jordan: 5:58

So we tried to find this intersection that we feel like we have found, that really has a good balance of strong mental growth, but also growth that men are challenged to and called to more. So it's basically like running a marathon together with men, and we believe that sustained growth over a long period of time best occurs in a group environment as opposed to by yourself. So you know, it's why a lot of people read a book, love it, get a lot out of it and but then have trouble applying it over a sustained period of time. So it's really my personal experiences with groups, coupled with having experienced in the past men investing in me and wanting to create an environment where men of any age, any season of life, any success level could come. And I believe that every man is stuck in some area of his life. You know, even a high performer, there's some area of their life where they're stuck and they want to get unstuck. And that's really what this is about is for men to experience that growth.

R. J. Campbell: 7:00

Wow, that's pretty cool. So, mark, what is the name of the group? We never even asked.

Mark Jordan: 7:05

Yeah, it's unraveled. So the 501c3 is Unraveled Groups Inc. The name of the group is Unraveled and that comes from in case that's what you're curious about. Next comes from a verse and a set of verses in Isaiah that we really feel like communicate this idea of disintegration and then reintegration. It's Isaiah 6-1 through 8. And we think, before you can really have significant growth, you've got to have this disintegration process that occurs and we feel like that's part of what was occurring in that passage there this unraveling or disintegration process that then leads to a reintegration. So that's what that's about, that's what the name's about and that's the significance of it.

R. J. Campbell: 7:56

So how do you say disintegration? Almost like a perem down before you build them up.

Mark Jordan: 8:01

Yeah yeah, it's like you know you first. I love Henry Cloud's definition of integrity the courage to meet the demands of reality. So the first thing we have to do is we have to accept what our reality is, and that reality is oftentimes, oftentimes all the time, for all of us, because none of us are perfect. It requires tearing down, breaking apart, pulling off, letting go of getting rid of disintegrating these areas that we need to shed before we can really then have a healthy approach to growth. And, of course, no one ever gets there completely. One of our other mantras is progress, not perfection, because, as you guys know, the more you encounter growth in your life, the more aware you become of how far behind you are, how much you have to do. So it seems you've been to sit in shame and go, wow, okay, there's no point to even do this. So we want men to get excited about making progress. Take a step forward. Don't worry about perfection, it's not happening. Let's just focus on making the progress.

Coach Dustin: 9:05

Be better every day is what we say. Be better tomorrow than we are today.

Mark Jordan: 9:07

So Exactly right Not be perfect tomorrow, but be better tomorrow.

Coach Dustin: 9:12

I love that. Yeah, I love it. So I've got a question and this might just be for us, but as we're starting to grow the balance business, well, first of all, how long has this organization been around?

Mark Jordan: 9:22

So four years ago we started alpha testing and beta testing in groups. We had over 100 men engage, participate in the groups, with just such wonderful transformational testimonies from not only the men but their friends, their spouses, their girlfriends. Just so much. It was just so exciting. But we tested it, tweaked it a little bit and then, q2 of last year, we formed the 501C3, launched the 501C3 with our goal brace yourself, it's a big goal, but it reached a million men in 10 years. That's what we want to do reach a million men in 10 years. So we've gotten off to a great start. We're really excited about the engagement we've had to this point, really excited about that. But that's really what our goal is is to reach a million men in 10 years and for them to have a life-changing experience.

Coach Dustin: 10:21

I love that.

Coach Dustin: 10:24

So, as we're on these paths together to help men, to help dads, to help what we have found and I would love to hear your feedback on this we also talked to another kind of pioneer of this men work, or at least somebody we look up to, larry Hagger, who runs the dads edge that he ran across this as well, but sometimes it's hard to get men to admit that, hey, I need some help and I need the growth.

Coach Dustin: 10:52

And I was surprised by that because, again, I'm so in-dated with personal growth as somebody who's in that real estate industry and earlier this year I put on two events for business-related things. I also coach a lot of business people and sold it the Andy Room only. It was an amazing experience. So I'm like, all right, this is awesome. And then we had our workshop what six, seven weeks ago now? And it was like pulling teeth to get guys there and I was totally taken aback by that, because to me, this is what everyone means who cares about the business, this and I would love to hear your experience on that if you've felt that as well, or maybe you're just a lot better than us and we're not doing it right.

Mark Jordan: 11:30

So no, I doubt that. Very seriously, I can say this the two things that we've learned over the years is that one is is that we just have accepted and encouraged ourselves as a team to understand, believe and brace this idea that you cannot want it more than the other person. The other person has to want it more than you. That's just crucial. So that frees us up to focus on the men who do want it more than us. That's number one.

Mark Jordan: 12:05

And the second piece is is that you guys know this in marketing, just speaking to men's felt needs, right? So we want to speak to their felt needs so that they then can engage and get the real needs met. So their felt needs may be high level, superficial, maybe they're not even really at the core of what they really need. But if we completely just focus on and all of our content and environments are around just what we know they need, we believe they need, then we miss the felt need part. So we try to strike a balance with that, to focus on hey, we're touching your felt needs, engage as you get those touched and life given to that, then you'll be more inclined to recognize the bigger picture and the deeper things that are going to that are really going to be life changing for you. Love that.

Coach Dustin: 12:58

That was good and my head's spinning on that, so thank you. So I hear a lot of we in this, so is there you know other people in this organization that are helping you run it? Did you kind of start this as a brainchild of yourself?

Mark Jordan: 13:11

How did that start, man? I tell you guys, I am so fortunate. We have an incredible leadership team that's in place, and I'm not just talking about a leadership team that meets once a month and, you know, weighs in on some good ideas. We have guys that they are spending an immense amount of time because they're passionate, they believe in what we're up to. So that's number one very exciting that we have a strong leadership team that's just executing on stuff. And we've got responsibilities divided, of course, from training to marketing to, you know, content, et cetera, et cetera, but just really, given so much of their time, they're awesome.

Mark Jordan: 13:49

We have one staff person in place right now that focuses really on administration. So everything that's administration oriented our staff person focuses on, and then everyone else at this point are volunteers, and it's just exciting to see men be so passionate about something as I know you guys do as well, and to give their time of it. So I'm just so grateful for the leadership team. So when I say we, it's a legitimate way, I love it. I mean, I'm one part of it, but I'm not the biggest part by any stretch. Love that.

R. J. Campbell: 14:22

Wow, go ahead again. Let's say, give us a little bit about what is unraveling. You know kind of. What do guys need to know about it? What do you not, what do you give? But what do they give? Because you made mention before about looking for men willing to put in the work.

Mark Jordan: 14:37

Uh-huh, yeah, so we've got. When we first started at four years ago, we had one path, one group experience. It was. It's a year long experience and, listen, we'll just call it unravel one, for simplicity. Unravel one's 12 month small group experience, six to eight guys in a group and we have them virtually and in person. Most of our groups right now are virtually because we have been signing up from around the country. Actually, we have men from around the world that want to be in groups, but we don't, we're not able yet to, we don't have the infrastructure yet to do groups outside of North America. So right now they're all in the U? S and they're virtual and in person.

Mark Jordan: 15:16

As I said, 12 month long group. They meet once a month for three hours and what? There's a lot of work outside of that monthly meeting, though it's not just show it for once a month and have three hours, and that's part of the pursuit of excellence, what they're doing outside of that In every month. Past specific skills, for example, we want men to learn to be better at conflict resolution. We want them to be better at communication. We want them to be, have greater understandings, understanding about their vision. When they leave, when they're finished with unravel, they're going to have a clear vision, a God given vision for their future. They're going to have a practical framework for moving that vision forward. They're going to have a mission statement. They're going to have a personal testimony and they're going to have they're going to have been challenged along the way to some pretty incredible you know activities, if you will, or or with tasks that are going to cause them to realize they can do more than they thought possible. Then, after unravel one, no obligation, but men have the opportunity to go to unravel two. That's a six month environment that just focuses on leadership Small group, six date, guys once a month, three hours, same idea. Then our what we want is for guys in after unravel two to move to the final landing place, which is unravel three. That's a lifelong group. Think I don't know if you guys can move to Inkling CS Lewis, jr Tolkien they had a group that they met weekly at Oxford when they were all there, called the Inklings, and the Inklings was a group that really they challenged each other to refine their craft. They could weigh in, they could, and I was always struck by how powerful these, these incredible men who've accomplished so much, are still willing to meet together with other men and listen to their feedback. So unravel three is a small group environment that meets monthly. That is a space for men to be able to communicate, not without editing their comments.

Mark Jordan: 17:15

In life, changing big topics, big things that matter that, particularly in today's world, it's hard to find the space to to dialogue about, you know, things that are controversial, challenging. So everything's open that leads to growth. And then what we've done now we just launched earlier this year and now we're launching two more in the next two months as we have shorter content on ramps so that men who go I'm not ready for a 12 month commitment. That's a big commitment. We've got these six sessions, let's call them that are self pay, self, self study. If you will, content that we provide men that they can engage in to go. Oh well, okay, I can. This progress I can make now want to sign up and unravel. So that's everything now and then we're. You know we'll continue to launch more of these on ramp courses. If you will. That then we'll provide a place for men and away from them to get involved in what we really want them involved in, which is unravel one, two and three. That's awesome, Wow, wow.

R. J. Campbell: 18:17

That is a lot of work you were committing. Yeah, it worked to make yourself better.

Mark Jordan: 18:23

We are. You guys know this and the and the and all the endeavors you're involved in. As you go into things and you're, you're, you're serving and your, your first reaction is to think, oh, I'm well, I'm, I'm helping this person. But at the end of the day, we get so much more back than we ever give Right. So you guys know that you've experienced that all the time.

Coach Dustin: 18:43

Yeah, yeah, that's amazing. I love it. So who was marked before unravel? Because this is a lot. So I would love to hear you know your, your background, before you got into this world.

Mark Jordan: 18:56

I have an investment banking company, a mergers and acquisition company called Vircore. Like the mountain range in Europe, vircore advisors. And so my core business, you know, has been investment banking and mergers and acquisitions, m&a advisory work. That's been my core business over the years, which I love and and grateful for, and it's been been very rewarding and I my experiences outside of that have also been very crucial and shaping and forming me.

Mark Jordan: 19:24

I've been very fortunate to be a part of, I was a part of, along with several hundred other people, starting a church in Atlanta, georgia, north Point Ministries. That became a you know, just an incredibly impactful church around the world and I learned so much there from leaders like Andy and others at North Point. I'm very fortunate to have, you know, spiritual mentors like Ken Boa, who's just a wonderfully wonderful man, incredibly bright you know theologian speaker, author. And then I've got to continue to experience over the years. We were part of starting a church in North Hollywood about 10 years ago. That you know was a wonderful experience. So I've just had all these incredible you know spiritual experiences and encounters and endeavors and marry that with my work. I've just been very fortunate in being being around a lot of people who have cut a lot of time off my learning curve. Great leaders, people that are pursuing excellence in their lives and really trying to make a difference.

R. J. Campbell: 20:25

Wow, is it North Point? Isn't that Andy Stanley? Isn't that his church?

Mark Jordan: 20:28

Yeah, andy, stanley, yeah North Point.

R. J. Campbell: 20:31

I just did a teach last night with a group on how good is good enough. His little bitty book.

Mark Jordan: 20:39

Yes, he is great. One thing I always say about Andy is Andy is if you get a chance to, if you're a chance behind the scenes to see Andy I was an elder at North Point for a few years and he is so consistent. How he is, you know, publicly is how he is personally. Andy is one of the best leaders I've ever been around in my life. He's obviously an incredible communicator. What people don't realize oftentimes is how great of a leader he is as well. Just a wonderful experience and all the people there.

Mark Jordan: 21:11

I was a part of a lot of ministries here as well I got to be a part of and that were great. And I want to add too that's all part of this formation of Mark's journey is an incredible wife of 35 years that I've learned and grown so much from, and two children, two daughters that both got married last year and so fortunate to have these just spectacular sons-in-law that I'm just so my wife and I love so much and so excited and they continue to teach us so much. You know you're thinking you're always teaching your kids stuff and everything, but I mean our daughters, you know, of course, are grown adults now, but our sons-in-law, they're all teaching us stuff regularly. So all that kind of continues to come together on this journey of growth for me, and just so grateful.

Coach Dustin: 21:58

I love that. I'm waiting because the success. I knew there had to be a woman behind that, because there isn't all of our eyes.

Mark Jordan: 22:04

I was waiting for that, so no doubt about that.

R. J. Campbell: 22:09

So Mark and I are about the same age. We've both been married 35 years. I only had one daughter get married last year. My only daughter. Her two big brothers were already married a couple years before that. So yeah, so we got a lot we're sharing here in the same amount of time.

Mark Jordan: 22:25

That's right. She got married last year too. That's exciting, man, and I hope your son-in-law is wonderful, as our two are so, because it's a great experience to share.

R. J. Campbell: 22:35

Yep so far pretty blessed and our two daughters-in-law that we already had. They're very, very lucky so anyway, I digress but I think that's funny. We're just traveling down a very similar path, time-wise.

Coach Dustin: 22:47

Yeah that is. I love this. So, in leaving with the business dad, first of all, I'm over here taking notes, a lot of notes. So I love the pursuing of excellence, because are you ever excellent? Absolutely not. It's the pursuit of excellence. But what is the one tangible thing, you should say, the strategy, the tip that we can leave these business dads with on how they can be better tomorrow than they are today?

Mark Jordan: 23:16

Well, that's great, it's funny. One of the things my daughters have worked on me over the years, and my wife as well, is my tendency is because I have seen my dad. My tendency is because I have so much I want to say is to take like 30 minutes to answer a question that you know would prefer to be answered one or two minutes. Right, and so I've got well. But this part is important too, and they've certainly forced me to grow in that area over the years, to, you know, to find more succinct ways of saying things and then give people space to ask more if they want to. So so many things I could say the one thing that pops into my head that I would say this I love this phrase that I think a friend of mine and I came up with it one day, and we're waterskin. Maybe we heard it and didn't know it, but maybe it's the only thing I've ever come up with. Everything else I've borrowed and stolen from other people and, who knows, maybe I heard it, heard it someplace before, but it's. You can have almost anything you want, but you can't have everything you want. So I'll say it again you can have almost anything you want, but you can't have everything you want, and obviously it's a broad statement and it's not meant to be taken literally.

Mark Jordan: 24:19

The point to it is this is that our lives are a series of choices and tradeoffs that we have to make in our lives. In fact, andy wrote a great book, or I don't know if he wrote a book. We did a message one time. I think he called it choosing to cheat, or something like that. It's just the same idea that if you want to be and pursue what it means to be a great father, you know there there are other areas of your life that you're going to have to say no to. You know you can't have that and and and and. If you want to take, you know, around the world trip, then you may have to say no to some other financial choices. So it's most applicable. I think economically that's the easiest place to place to apply it, but I think it applies just in our lives in general. It's like realize you have to make trade-offs, you have to say no to things so that you can have something better, it's all about that balance.

Coach Dustin: 25:09

I love that. What a great, great way to end it. Thank you, mark. I am super excited about all the notes that I have, because my head is spinning right now, which I always mean to as a great episode. Wow, this was good. Guys, make sure you go back and relish into this, because there's a lot of tips and strategies in there that I know I'll be putting into place, so I hope you do as well, arjun. Any last questions from Mr Mark?

R. J. Campbell: 25:31

No, so the website is unravelcom correct.

Mark Jordan: 25:34

Actually, thank you for clarifying it's it's unravel groupscom. Okay, all right, unravel groups, unravel groups Com. So thank you for for clear. We'll make sure we have that in the short notes as well.

R. J. Campbell: 25:45

We will, yeah, please, yeah, I spent some time on that today and it is. It is really cool. This is one you if people are watching this hot video seeing Dustin and I smiling through it, mark it is the. It's people talk about the balanced business dead. Sometime. We refer to it as our mission and we've had people lately say it's almost a ministry and yours is the same, going through that and reading about it in the different levels, and I Love that. It the the amount of work involved and it's it's substantial, it's a commitment and it really means it is for men who are it's a select few. This is not for everybody. This is for the men who are willing to put in this kind of work to be better in every way. It's it's it's pretty spectacular.

R. J. Campbell: 26:32

I was looking at it today thinking, wow, do I have enough to commit to this? Very different between interested and committed Dustin, here's me say that all the time I'd like. Right now I'm very interested and I have to decide if I could be committed to that because that's a heck of a 12 months. But wow, it looks like a just a fantastic program. So that's my commercial from somebody who knows nothing about it first, you know first hand.

Mark Jordan: 26:56

Thank you so much. Thank you. It's great being with you guys to great. Yeah, I'm chatting and I'm excited what you all, you, what you all are up to as well with With your endeavor and the balanced business. Dad, it's, it's. I love it, just for making a difference man, I appreciate that.

Coach Dustin: 27:11

Thank you so much. Guys, again, go back really into this, because there's tons that mark said that I know that you can grow with. Go check out his website. We'll have that in the show notes as well. And, guys, until next week, be better. We'll talk to you next time, just be, better, we're out.